Welcome to the show everybody. We are back still on zoom. figuring this out. We’re all here, including our spirit animal, which is Nannette’s cat.
And pet tiger.
Exactly. Yeah. Nannette is the Tiger Queen.
Where’s the dog?
The dog is outside today. Gotcha.
We’re here talking about grit, right? Because it’s one of the most important parts of being in a sales role because you have to be persistent. You have to let certain stuff go. And we’re going to be talking for at least today if not more, cat butt, about how specifically we stay in the mindset so that way we can keep moving things forward and not getting bogged down, you know, with no’s or you know, how you feel about stuff and so especially right now with everything that’s going on, right. There’s a lot of distractions and you got to stay focused because there’s always going to be a time element to selling. So let’s, I mean, Clint, we were talking about this before we launched in our, in our text, you know, talking about the topic and Clint said, I’m gonna let Clint said what do you say Clint?
Oh, grits my middle name. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it’s it’s uh, it’s what I as what has probably gotten me through everything is you know, I always use the term grit and bear it, but just you know, bite the bullets coming you got to just go with that man. I don’t know any other way to say it other than, you know. You let the little stuff bog you down and it’s so easy to quit. Right? And I you what I what I think of when I when I hear grit is like, survival shows, right? There’s 10 people on that episode and the first five are like they’re looking for any excuse to quit right? To call in the chopper to save them from the island, right? There’s, there’s five people that want to stay to the end. And then there’s those five, they get a cut on their finger, or they stub their toe, and it’s like, get me, Oh, well, I finished because I got a cut on my hand. And those people, they have zero grit in my in my book, that’s those survivors that are in it to the end, they’ll take on any task, you know, whether they’re they know they’re going to fail or not. They just, they get it they get after it.
So how much of your grit comes from like the military background? And how much of it just comes from being you and being a D?
Yeah, I mean, obviously, the military background definitely helps in the fact that there is no quit because you don’t have that option. There’s it’s life or death. And obviously, you’re not going to choose death. So there’s no just, I’m going to quit and go do something else there. You know, in a combat situation anyway. So yeah, there’s that and, and you definitely develop a mentality to that. But, but you know, being you know, that’s how I was in life long before the military and whatever sport I played in I was, I was, if I was going to do it, I was going to try to excel to the best of my ability at it. I didn’t really care what anybody else thought or, you know, told me I could or could do that never, ever really played a factor. So I just kind of went the same same way in my professional life, you know, you know, hey, I don’t I don’t know if you’re gonna be real good at this whole, you know? Screw you. I’ll figure this out.
Can ask you a question? How many whippings did you get growing up? Oh, God. You know, I think there’s a direct correlation there.
Yeah, I mean, you know, I want to say dad used the the belt a lot, but man, mom was mean too, she, man. He liked that belt. And they’re all listening. So you know.
The worst thing my mother could say was We need to wait till your father gets home because man, I wanted her punishment, though she could dish it out. But man If my father came home and my mother was able to handle the situation, oh, there was hell to pay. Hell to pay. Yeah.
Child, you know, to that point, I think I think my childhood at least is, you know, at least the way my parents raised me. I think that’s where my internal grit comes from. No doubt about that.
Well, I you know, I grew up with a dad that was an electrician. And you know, he said to me once before, your mother’s job is to worry, mine’s to put my work boots on and go to work and make a living and feed you guys. And he said, you know, as you get older and you go down the road, he’s like, if you need anything you call me. But if you don’t have that in your pocket, you’re the greater fool in this whole equation, right? Because you can’t call for help. And so you learn these little idioms that I think think allow you to think ahead, prepare, have your own Moxie, but know when to call in the troops to kind of help you out. Right. And I don’t know how that relates to grit. But but in a certain sense, you know, I almost texted, you can’t confuse grit with stupidity, right, because some people just grind it out. And their endeavors are, you know, no fault of their own, they just can’t see past the end of their nose. So they keep repeating the same gritty of this. I don’t see that as classic grit, right. I see that.
No that is, 100% and I noticed too, like when I’m around some even my friends you know, it’s like we’ll be you know, let’s just say working on a car working, you know, doing some construction together something at their house. It’s it’s so much easier for some friends to just say, Hey, I’m just, let’s pick this up tomorrow and I’m thinking I don’t want to continue knew this on anymore. Let’s just get this done like oh, well I need my eight hours of sleep like, dude, I don’t care about sleep like let’s just get this degree you know and and and some people have that and it’s not right or wrong because I appreciate the people that can pick it up another day. I just unfinished tasks for me are just I mean they’re they’re huge grenades in my head you know that go off because I got to get that task done. And I think having that mentality is where a lot of my grits born, it’s just get after it, get it done. So you can move on to the next thing.
Yeah, I agree.
When, when does it, When does it become a negative thing? Like because arguably, I’m too far on the other way of always trying to think of like, the smartest way to do it right? And sometimes you just have to get in there and do it enough. So that way you figure out like the way that you need to do it. And I’m and I’m aware that sometimes I’m slow to start because I’m like, oh, there’s a better way. There’s a better way there’s a better way, but I’m curious like where are you Whereas the sweet spot like how do you how do you determine when you’re, when it’s time to change the, the method?
Yeah, there’s a, I think there’s definitely a gauge of, you know, especially in sales, there’s a, there’s a financial scale that you play in, right? where it makes sense to keep chasing, you know, like a certain customer, right? You’ve, let’s just put it like this, you know, you have a new customer that wants you to bid 10 projects, but they’ve never given one, you know, is it? Is it smart to have some grit and keep grinding and out hoping that you might get one or is it you know, maybe smarter to look at the facts and say, Okay, I’m at a zero percent hit ratio with these people. let’s dump it move on. There are those people though that will bid 500 jobs to that person,
But I think, go ahead, no, finish what you said.
I just think that you know it at the same time, like it takes a lot of grit to go through that much work like you have to You have to have a lot of, you know, personal. I don’t know what you call it, but like just just to grind it out to get there. And even if you don’t ever get there, that’s grit to me.
No, I get it this way. I kind of just Yeah, exactly. I just agree. I think that’s your, your avoidance of the true grit, the True Grit is, hey, Clint, I’ve been able to these jobs. And it feels like I’m having I’m just giving free consulting so you can go out and and, you know, use my information to, you know, get a better deal or do something down the road. You know, how can we change that right? How do we, I still want to try to do a good job for you. But this job, I’m going to kind of sit back and say, what makes me what would make you think that I would be somebody you would want to do work with? Maybe we should take a pass and call the guy that did your last job. Have you spoken to him yet? That’s a gritty statement right there. When you put it I’m in somebody else’s face that either disrespecting you that they’re not being fair they’re not being an adult. They’re not being, You don’t have equal business stature.
Yeah, and that’s a really good point. gritty, the gritty statement is, is in my head when you say the word grit I think of a few people one of them we spoke earlier like Clint Eastwood the John Wayne’s, you know those people that just tell it how it is the silent people that act instead of you know, talk about acting all the time. And it’s cool because that that same scenario can come in any personality form. Especially like the archetype, the DISC right is Yeah, you know, the D can, the D is going to be a little more up front and in your face about it. The I is going to play it off as kind of a joke but get his point across. The C is going to be in facts and figures. And the S is going to tell you everything that you don’t want to hear but you’re going to love her at the end of it or love him at the end of it. I mean, it’s just, you know, it can grit can come in all shapes and sizes there. Yeah,
I think. I think, to me grit is a mindset like you. It’s how you think how you’re going to pursue something and your purpose. Like, for me, it’s always it has always, I’ve always been gritty, because I always have a purpose. And you know, I want to get somewhere with something. And I remember when I first started in sales, I was thinking, Oh my gosh, I have got to survive like it was a survival at first. I mean, literally, you know, I was like, man, I got it. I gotta feed the kids here. And now it’s more of an ego thing where I I noticed that the other day, instead of looking at the, and I’ve done this, I’ve said this before, I think I’ve always done this. I’m more it’s more interesting to me. And more of my pursuit is more of my numbers, not my the dollar sign. I wanted it If I’m not being if someone doesn’t perceive me as successful being, if I don’t think I’m successful, then that just makes me probably even grittier. I’m just like, I have got to, you know, my mindset has to, there’s so many examples of that. But the first time I really saw that was my middle son in football, he probably didn’t have the talent as much as he had the heart. And that, to me, that’s what grit is when, you know, it’s not necessarily how smart you are, how far how that tenacity, just like you are going to make it happen. Clint was talking about getting stuff done, you know, I mean, I’m constantly How do I do this better? You know, and I think that, I think it is a mindset. That’s to me what grit is just your attitude about…
That was such a, that was such a D statement. Right? I mean, it sounded very, very, very much like exactly the same thing that Clint was saying. Better spoken you know, but
Don’t make fun of the old country boy.
but but solidly in that same idea of like don’t tell me I’m not going to do this because I’m just going to prove you wrong, right.
But Nan, Nan brought up a good point you know when she brought up heart as in you know, you know where your where your emotions drive you, right. Either, you know, are you emotionally ready for success? Are you emotionally ready to drive yourself towards success at all costs? I mean are you willing to you know really put your heart and soul into this project and like into Clint’s, you know, credit and see that endeavor through right. Don’t take that day off until you have a win don’t don’t put it on the shelf until you’ve succeeded and yeah, I think if you you know burn all your bridges if you you know if there’s no retreat, hey, you’re there in it in it to win it. Right.
Yeah, that heart heart and grit can be interchanged in my book. Yeah, that guy’s got a lot of grit. That guy’s got a lot of heart. I think they’re very so there’s a point, Nan, they’re pretty interchangeable there.
Do you think them? Do you think of them as being different quality qualities then? What was
What? Grit and hearts?
Like, like, like, do you think there’s a difference? And if so, what do you think it is?
Well, like when I was talking about emotions, I think emotions are dangerous. I think if he you know, I think a lot of times people can if you let your emotions run you, you easily fail easily could fail, because you can just talk yourself out of stuff and you can say, Oh, I you know, if you’re, if your brain isn’t telling you get going, get out of the bloomin car and go into that office or whatever. Today when I was walking, I had to share this because it literally happened an hour ago, walking and I’m thinking about you No, and all of a sudden I look up in the sky and I hear this you know bird this little bird is chasing this big Hawk and this Hawk is like dangit. And I and I went there’s grit. You know you don’t know you’re you’re not looking at something is really scary you’re like I get away or whatever he needed that to control and i think i think that’s a bit that’s why I said the mindset thing because be in control of your emotions do not let them run away like if you if you’re scared if you have fears whatever you cannot, and man, Al, I, I think I learned a lot of that from our because and I think we have we all have it. You just can not be fearful I’m sorry I’m moving so much with my cats, getting ready to jump on the computer. But you you know you cannot let that whole emotion things roll you are you will be screwed. You know nice, really believe that.
So I’m curiously courage. Courage has a lot to do with grits, right? I mean, there’s, there’s a big drive, I think your grit is driven by courage, that, that you have to have a lot of people just, you know, because you have to want to do something to have grit in it, right? Like you have to have that one and the courage to do it. And to your point and like hopping out of a car to go to your first coal, you know, like your meeting, or you know, the gate, like those. Those days aren’t easy for anybody. I mean, obviously, we all have some better, you know, internal powers that get us through it a little easier, but I don’t think that’s truly easy for anybody and it takes a lot of courage, a lot of guts and grit, whatever you want to call it. But you know, the fact is, you got to get out of the car, something done and if you don’t do it, you don’t have any of those qualities.
That’s why y’all they still can’t remember stop me because I really don’t want to repeat this if I’ve already said this, but I was watching This preacher and he was talking about learning how to hold his breath. They were teaching him how to hold his breath for longer than a minute. And so he goes underwater. He’s the instructor says go under and I will tap you when your minute is up. And he said, you know, he’s looking at his watch he’s 30 seconds and he’s like dang and I’m not gonna make it but I’m gonna you know, and he was just determined to do this minute, got up, and then the instructor said, okay, and go down again, you will be able to keep hold your breath for two minutes now. He was like, What? I almost died. I literally almost died. He goes, you can do it, just do it, go under and do it. And this time, he didn’t let him have his watch. He did it for two minutes, but he thought it was all his thought if he wouldn’t have been looking at them. You know, it’s the whole watching the pot thing. Your your brain can talk you out of all kinds of things, you know, so So, a lot of times, I don’t mean to keep I don’t over use the word mindset, but it is it is totally what you think about something if if you’re going to succeed or not.
So for John, I would guess you face this the most. With the with the overcoming the odds of something right, it doesn’t work in your favor. And to just have that grit to power through kind of a gut feel, I would say you’re probably challenged with this the most out of the four of us and our personalities.
True. So it depends upon the situation. You know, when I was thinking about grit today, I was thinking about the other side of grit, in my opinion of it is sunk cost, right? And, you know, sunk cost is this idea that you put effort or time into something so then you’re more committed to making it work, right. And there’s this poker analogy that I talk about all the time that you know, I could be sitting at a table, right with my with my entry level stack, and if I lose 20 bucks, I don’t feel right about getting up from that table to go to another table that might be way juicy or, and way easier and a better lineup and everything else like this until I get my 20 bucks back, right because it mentally, it doesn’t really make a lot of sense because I could be over here making hundreds of dollars, but I’m stuck right here trying to do this thing to get this 20 bucks back so that way I feel good about moving over. So it’s weird because I feel like there there there are areas where I’m not very gritty, because I’m looking for the improvement. And so maybe my grit shows up is just like finding this constant improvement. You know, we were talking before we started about some of the weird experiments that I put myself through, right, you know, for these for this constant idea of trying to improve. And so right now like I’m trying to do 100 days of handstands, right 100 days in a row handstands because, you know, I, you know, it’s good for strength. It’s good for flexibility. It’s good for a lot of things and I’m not really going to a gym right now. So you know, let’s just do something thing to get out of my head and into my body. And so, you know, I go out in the backyard in or I go to a friend’s house here in my neighborhood and we do handstands for like 15 minutes. And, you know, it’s nice and it’s helpful, but like I showed you guys the video and, you know, Clint told me. Man, the stuff you do is just ridiculous. Like, you just put yourself through these things, because it’s like, it’s like, I have to constantly push myself to improve. So like, I’ve got a lot of grit around, like, I want to be my best version of myself. But I don’t have that same attachment to this method, or this way, has got to be the right way. But sometimes that’s not right, because it does show up in kind of weird and weird situations that don’t always serve me because that that sunk cost bias is definitely a thing, right? And we see that in sales of, you’re too attached. Right? So you start hoping, and then what happens is you you get ran over, right? You get put into these loops of you know, stalls and objections and maybe next week and just keep following up and we’ll get there eventually. And you have spent so much time that you now feel entitled to the business, right? And then whenever it does really fall apart because you didn’t do a good job of managing expectations and getting everybody involved, you’re just pissed. Because once once you’re through that loop, right, and you get the real closure, you can always look back on that. And you know that hindsight is always 20/20 deal and why did I spend so much time in this, like, I could have been doing any other number of things. So it shows up for me in very weird spots, but I do have a history of starting things and then being like, yeah, this wasn’t what I thought. This isn’t as fun as I thought it was going to be. I’ll I’ll make a change.
Yeah, I mean, that’s kind of a wandering answer.
You’re C. Yeah, you’re now you’re C flared so hard during that, it was fun.
I was talking to someone the other day, and they were asking me about the show because they seem to be sharing it and everything. And so they’re like, so what’s the story with this, and I was like, Well, you know, so I give them the the overview. And the guy was like, okay, so he goes and listens to and he goes, I don’t get it. I was like, okay, that’s fine. You know, I feel like once you listen to the show for a while, and you kind of have a grasp on where you are, and who in which team you line up with, it becomes really apparent how realistic this actually is to the real world. You know, because Nannette is love and Clint is get the hell out of my way. And I’m like, let’s look at the data, right? And then Al is like, hey, like, Let’s have a party and everybody’s invited. And I’m going to tell stories, right? So every episode is like a pretty real version of like, how this stuff can show up in your world, right? When you when you look at it through that lens. And so once I explained that he went, went listen to another one. He was like, Oh, yeah, now I get it, you know, so I, I like the fact that I C up a lot here because I don’t really feel in my normal role like day to day that I can really hang out in my C-ness right now. Like I get pushed to that I corner. Because I got to be out there so often and promoting myself and networking and all these things. So this is my like opportunity to say, hey, let’s look at graphs and like, let’s, let’s put together a budget guys, like, let’s, let’s do math, you know, and all and all these things that I find value in, but don’t really get a chance to do as much as I would like in my actual role.
Yeah. So what’s should, If they don’t have grit? Like how do you bring out your grittiness if you don’t have a
You know, my gut tells me that everybody has grit in something. And it’s probably something that you’re confident in and you’re interested in, and you’ll find that you probably have the grit or the courage or whatever to make it through just about any obstacle in that task. If you don’t have it in the task that you’re you’re in, I think, You’re probably in the wrong walk of life. I mean, obviously, there’s levels some people are just born with, you know, if it was a level one to 10 some, I think some people are born with a level three grit to, you know, in any situation and some people were born with it at 10. And, but at the same time, like I think when you’re confident in anything, like if you’re going to tear apart, you know, a Harley Davidson down to the nuts and bolts and put it back together and you’re unconfident, you’re going to get down to the third screw and quit, because, you know, you just like, what am I doing? I don’t know what I’m doing. And the guy that has all the confidence in the world and do that. He’ll he’ll spend all night all day getting it done, because he just knows exactly what to do. So I think there’s a level of that that plays with it, right? Yeah. So. So I don’t know that there’s any way to just develop a bunch of grit, other than you have to look at consequences of what you do. If you don’t, I think that’s a motivator.
Perseverance. So to me grit is ignited by your passion. So if you’re in sales and you don’t have grit find what will ignite your your grit like I said mine was I had to survive and now it is my ego you know what what is it that makes you
Yeah, Doc doc would say bank account right? Yeah, I don’t have anything in my bank account so I gotta have some grit to get through this you know, these situations I don’t want to deal with but I have well because I need to put money in there.
You know, you hit on something but you know, I’m practically a communist. So you know, I believe in community and I believe in humanity. And that may shock a few people. But I have a I have about 22 employees and I have a payday every Friday. There’s a certain portion of them get paid this week, a certain portion to get paid next week. And so I literally think it’s my responsibility to be able to meet payroll every week. And as I add to the Empire, if you will, my commitment is doing whatever it takes to make that money so that I can make payroll. And it’s crazy that it seems I’ve never missed payroll in 25 years. And I continue to try to give more within reason, and then request more on the backside. Right. So So from that, you know, if, if I feel like I’m getting ripped off by an employee, we have to have that conversation. If I, you know, if I, if I, if I’m stressed about the cash flow, then I gotta get busy and find more cash. And I don’t, I don’t attach any power to it. It’s just the process of running a business that requires that you you know, you may That work, along with paying rents and paying, you know, everything that everybody else has out there, right? I mean, look around your house, if you’re on a business, it is same damn thing. Water electricity, you know. So,
yeah. You know, for me when I think about, you know, grit and how to how to generate it, right. I think it’s like a two prong effect. Right? For me, there’s, there’s a great book by Simon Sinek. And it’s talking about Start With Why. Right, because there’s a lot of things that I do just for the experiment of it. You know, I’ve done like random experiments like me, I mean, for like, the past 10 years, right. But when the Why is not strong enough, it falls it falls apart, right? The minute stress enters the you know, the idea, you know, but to Al’s point, I mean his Why is he doesn’t want to miss payroll, right? He doesn’t want to miss you know, taking care of the people that are, you know, on his team and working with him, you know, and uh, That why can be anything like, like, it doesn’t have to be any certain thing and it has to be impactful for you. Because otherwise you’re going to lose the motivation, right? Because, Clint’s why is that he’s just not gonna fail. Right? So Clint has got like, why, like out the wazoo like, like, it just comes part and parcel with Clint like, he’s just gonna kill and crush anything is going to do. And I think that i think i think that some people will struggle with that because they’re not as task or goal oriented. And then the other thing that I think that people struggle with is we’re notorious for not setting really clear expectations about what our goals are, right? We’ve talked about SMART goals on the show and making measurable and time bound and adjust accurate and you know, all these things. And, you know, if the goal is just okay, cool, I’m gonna lose weight, right? But you don’t really set how much or by when or any of these things, then it just becomes this thing that you have to do for forever, right? And it’s really hard to be one thing for forever. Right? Says the guy who’s had, you know, way more jobs than anybody else on this show combined.
Oh, I don’t know about that.
And goals, and goals.
yeah. And goals, right? I mean, because, you know, I’m smart enough to realize that I don’t have everything all figured out, right? And sometimes my big old brain, right gets in the way of like actually taking action sometimes. So I try to I try to be very cognizant about my why in the, in the, in the reason why I’m doing these things so that way, it’s really easy in that moment of like, you know, today sucks, you know, of like, okay, but I can keep going because of this reason. So for me, like, that’s the most tactile way to make sure that I’m really bought into something, right? Like, Hey, is this gonna fall apart at the first moment of stress now, okay, why? Because it’s tied to this thing that that’s really important to me. Okay, cool. So then let’s make sure that we’re framing this in a way that I can actually win it know when I’m winning. Right? Because like you might be, you might be doing everything right and seeing small improvements, but you know, you’re impatient. You don’t have the time goal. You can just you’re just looking at the results and not the inputs and all these things, and then it’s just really easy to fail, right? Because Because you just quit. What are your What are your thoughts on that? Al?
You know, if I’m not good at something, you know, I’m not gonna do it, you know, and I don’t. If I suck at it, I gotta go hire somebody to do it, or just build a different game plan. I mean, I stay away from things that I’m not very good at. So it makes me look pretty awesome. Those every sitting here, it’s pretty easy, right? drinking a beer is damn easy, right? But occasionally, I dip my toe in some difficult projects. And hopefully I’ve got a team that supports that difficult project. And then I can begin to put people who are more qualified than myself in some hard hitting roles, and then give them the motivation to go ahead and the pep And they can do so. Um, yeah, I guess it’s good.
I was gonna say is that like a learned thing of just like experience of being a business owner and the various formats that you’ve done it so that way? Because like, I think a lot of people who were, you know, entrepreneurs and owners struggle with the idea of that team of, you know, like that cart horse in a scenario do I do I build the team before I get the revenue? Do I build the revenue before I have the team? And can I support that revenue without a team? You know, I’m curious, how did you build that skill set of being able to delegate?
Well, first of all, I think it’s kind of hard to run a barber shop if you’re not a barber, right? So you have to know all the parts and pieces that go into your project. So there’s, you know, you got to have a little bit of everything, but you don’t have to be spectacular at it but you got to be capable of it.
What do you think about that, Clint?
Oh, yeah, no, I you Doc, he said something, if you’re not good at it, you probably just won’t do it. And there’s there are some reality there, right that, that a lot of people think they’re great at everything I’m, I’m, I’m one of those people right until you get proven wrong. And sometimes the path that you’re down has been so long that now you got to grind it out because you can’t start over. Right so there is some some harsh truth that everybody has to come in to to say, all right, this is you know, this is my avenue in my life. This is what I’m good at. And I think, you know, to your point like with the barber shop, right is that I don’t have to be a great barber to own a barber shop I need to be a great businessman to open a barber shop right and hire barbers. There’s there’s a completely different mindset there.
But the one of the nuances is if the barbers don’t show up, you don’t have a business and you’re not qualified to do it, right. So it
And that’s where the businessmen comes in right.
Well, but, but, but I will tell you that you have To have some acumen and some capabilities, because it’s not all about just showing up and being a manager, right? You got to roll your sleeves up, you got to have have gone down the path Sure, so that you can then see when these people are going rogue or getting off the reservation or you got a bad apple that you got to pull. You got to be able to, you know, recognize and read the tea leaves as you go down the road in any industry to make sure that you’re not just running with scissors or about to fall off a cliff, you don’t know. Yeah,
no, I get that, you know, in my world every day, it’s I’m one because I’m a younger guy in the, you know, in the world that I live in and you get a challenge every day. Well, how much time have you done with this, everybody always wants, you know, some sort of, you know, validation that you know how to do this and, you know, it would be tough in my world not to have done. Some of it not be maybe the best at it, but to have not been a pipe fitter. And touch things with my own hands and the feet and stuff in to have that experience so that down the road when I’m selling it, I know something about it. To be honest with you in sales, it would have to be really tough to be a 100% salesperson in my business and have never done that, you know, in my mind that it would be for me to get over. So what are you? What are you laughing?
I’m laughing because I because you guys both sounds so incredibly C to me like what like right now this idea of like, you gotta have some acumen. Right and you need to have some experience, because,
well, I’ll tell you why. Because that that plays to our ego a little bit right? For me and doc that plays to credibility, not so much the facts, its credibility.
But I go back to sometimes time and rank, right. You know, being in an industry you’ve learned to shorten the learning curve. You figured the shortcuts that work to your advantage, so if you’ve got to go do another job quit or throw another CRM at somebody, you’ve kind of vetted enough of these things, and I know Nan knows the quick way into an office, right? She’s got her little bag of tricks.
What I was thinking is it sounds kind of bad, but fake it till you make it like come on, like know
Says every woman
sorry. Sorry, Grandma.
Grandma. Wow, Nan.
Nan, Yeah, I’m curious. You know, how do you feel about this thing? Like, like, how do you do you how much how much experience do you need to have grit in the moment for you.
I go back to What I said initially, you just all I need is to have heart to want to make it happen. And I always do. I, you know, I can’t say I always succeed, but I do always want to. And when I succeed, it’s because I don’t give up. And, you know, basically, that’s great, you know, you just, like, know what to do to make this happen and make it happen.
So I put out, I put out an offer last week and in the circles that I run in, you know, on on Facebook and LinkedIn, and I put out this offer, because what I’ve been offering is, hey, let’s hop on a call. I listen to you pitch your thing, and I’ll give you some feedback. And then, you know, I don’t really get a lot of a lot of action on those kinds of offers. So I decided, you know what, fuck it. Let’s go the other way. And so I made this post and Al’s nodding his head because I think he saw it. And I said, I’m just gonna blow stuff out there and I think I can sell your stuff better than you can So let’s get on a call. I’m going to ask you 10 questions. And then I’m going to show you how I would sell your stuff to qualify for fit, qualify for buy-in qualify around the known sticking points. And it’s been gangbusters, right? So like, this week, I’ve had lots of these calls. I probably had seven of these calls. And, like, three today, and it’s always crazy, right? Because these people show up. And everyone’s been nice so far, you know, like, like, no one’s been too much like, Oh, yeah, let’s go. That this this guy yesterday was like, Yeah, man, I don’t think I can do that. So okay, cool. We should, you know, leave it as a no then. No. And he was like, Yeah, okay. And the guy was doing a very good job of being very present in the roleplay and adjusting the roleplay to make it as actionable and realistic as possible. So we got to announce I said, Okay, cool. Now that we’re done, can I put on the consultant hat for a second? Because you’re not gonna hire me anyway, so I might as well just give you some free advice. And he goes, Yeah, he said, you’re looking at this the wrong way. He was like, What do you mean? And I was like, Well, you know, and I kind of went into, like, why he was looking at it the wrong way. And he was like, Oh, yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. So like, what does this actually do? And then he stops and he was like, no way. Like, what? And he was like, no way. And I was like, Are we still in the roleplay? He’s like, no, we’re out of the roleplay. Like, how did that happen? You know, and it’s just, I’m just going with you. Right? I’m going with you. I’m allowing you to feel like you’re in control. Right? Because you are right, because I can’t make you say yes. So as soon as we as soon as you give me the No, I don’t have anything else to lose. I might as well like Babe Ruth at this point at that fence. And that’s essentially what I did. And and he was like, Wow, this is awesome. Like, you know, do how do you how do you know when to use it? And it gets this really interesting conversation because it’s just like, for a long time, you know, we know all these techniques because of all the coaching we’ve done, and I and I had this realization last week that I’ve been hiding behind these techniques. Because when the technique fails, I don’t fail. It’s it’s a failure in the technique, right. And so I’ve been using these like techniques is kind of like armor and shield and stuff. Because you know, as a C, I need to be technically correct. And last week I had this realization of like, I need to be treating this more like Kung Fu, like, like, this just comes out of me in the moment, and I need to be not so fixated on the techniques. And my conversations have significantly changed since last week. And when when realizing that I was hiding behind these techniques. So it’s been pretty interesting. Because to your point, right, because I was thinking that I was going to say this, and y’all were going to be like, Oh, yeah, no, but you know, I put in all the adjacent work, right already. So it’s not like I’m showing up with nothing, right? I’m showing up with like a skill set and a process that I practiced and honed, to where like, I can own it. And it’s been interesting because it’s also been challenging because I have to come up with you know, good questions about These industries and areas I have no no exposure in.
Yeah, I think more people need that kind of, you know, it, you know, is in we’ve all been there because we’ve all we know each other’s past. We’ve done that roleplay. And I know, I can, I can kind of guess around the board, you know, how and why he has their opinion about roleplay. You know, and I guess I say this to our audience, because in repetition and the grit and the grind of actually using that time to roleplay, which isn’t always the most comfortable thing and to make your mistakes, to get past those. And there’s usually a handful of them that just really hamstring you in a sales school. And if you’ll go through and roleplay that, you know, like you’re describing with somebody who’s qualified to get you beyond those. And I, you know, if you’re not doing that, then you’re leaving money on the table. And, you know, I know Clint, Clint thinks this is bullshit. Yeah. Nan’s afraid of it. I kind of like it. But I don’t sink my teeth. But no, I, you live by it. Right. I love it.
Now, you know, like, when I worked at Chase, and you know, at&t and some of these other companies, they did it the worst way possible, right? It’s like It’s like a half day block of instruction, and everybody’s there. And there’s 35 people and the people from different branches and locations that you never met before. And to make you stand up in front of the whole group and roleplay and it’s terrifying, right? Because there there’s no real clear understanding about like, why these things are important. But now on the other side of this, when I when I look at it from like the martial art lens, Like, cool, if I just keep doing this punch, it’s going to get better and better and better and better. And I might only be like half a percent with like each rep. But I’m okay with earning half a percent on on a repetition because eventually I’m going to be solid, you know, and so that’s what’s kind of like shifted my, my approach to roleplay.
For me that that’s kind of like the whole Floyd Mayweather thing, right? You know, he was at a fight, and they’re sitting in the back room and someone’s like, hey, you’re not going to warm up, you’re not going to like practice or anything else. And it’s like, if I didn’t bring it with me by now. It’s not, you know, I’m not I’m not finding it today. So the, you know, I think because I do the same thing. Now. I try very hard not to over prep for my calls. Because what happens is I start making a bunch of assumptions, right? And then what happens is I’m is I’m in this call, and I’m sometimes not even conscious of it, that I’m leading them towards this thing that like, I want to focus the conversation on as opposed to opening that up and being like, Hey, what do you want to talk about this? Why that? Well, because listen, listen.
How do you how do you role play when your first question is, what do you talk about? about, you know what I mean? How do you roleplay that because you don’t know the answer. And so I think there’s, I think there’s things that you practice and I think that there’s, there’s certain nuances that you go ahead of the flow and the tonality. You know what you’re going to do if you know they say them, some of those pre pre loaded in your mind, but you can’t. You can’t sit there and structure it all out, because man, it’s just like, it’s just like combat. The first thing to go awry, is the plan that you made to go into combat. It’s the very first thing that should go to shit.
And I think getting back to the grit, you do need to have a purpose Like what? Maybe your roleplay isn’t verbatim what you’re going to say what you think they’re going to say. But it’s more of this is what I would like to accomplish. And I think you probably do that plan. I think all of us. I don’t go into a sales call without thinking I would like to at least know this before I leave, you know, and hopefully have an agenda in my head of what I want to leave with, as opposed to just going in, you know, not having any kind of ideas of what to accomplish in that meeting.
Yeah, I mean,
Look, I’ve had, I’ve had, I’ve had very long car rides, where we’re going to meet customers, and, you know, it might be one of my bosses at the time. And, you know, they’ll say, hey, let’s talk about what we’re going to go over. Right. And, and I play along for a little while until it’s like a I kind of blocked you on I just kind of go on auto answer because this is not how this conversation is going to go. And if you’re psyching yourself up so much in your head, that this is how it’s going to be what happens when it doesn’t go like that you’re just screwed, right? And especially if you’re the personality on here that’s not on my and Doc’s side of the spectrum that can wing it. Right? We have that gift naturally that can just kind of bullshit your way through it. Doc more than me, but you know what happens if you’re the C or the S? And you just get stuck? Like that’s that’s not good. So I don’t know I just mentioned I don’t mean to shit on roleplay I just you got to do it right and man full right for for your industry there is there is a right or wrong way, and you have to figure that out.
Yeah, I agree completely. I know. Hold on. We’re gonna keep talking about grit. Next week, we’re going to do a little bit, two episode. Sure. Yeah. So next week, we’re gonna be talking about
So no more for you out there. You got to wait.
That’s right. You gotta wait for next week. So we’re gonna be back next week continuing to talk about grit. If you have any specific areas where you would like us to talk about grit of our no’s around pipeline around winning communications with the team, anything like that, please send us a Tweet at sales throwdown on Twitter. If you would like to take the assessment email disc at sales throwdown Comm. We will be back next week. If you’re watching this on YouTube, please subscribe, share this with somebody else. And we’re gonna be sending out a survey to get feedback from anybody who has an opinion about what we should be doing with this show. Because we’re not, we’re not here if it’s not for you guys. So be on the lookout for that. If you’re not signed up, please sign up for the mailing list at SalesThrowdown.com and we will see everybody next week. Thanks a lot guys.