Episode 50: When to Call It Over and Your Sales Process



What is up everybody? Clint is down there flexing. Back at it.

I call it a stretch but whenever you want to call it.

Gun show, gun show.

We are talking today about when do you call it over? Like how far is too far? When do you start saying no. And this is important because it’s super easy to get your hopes up and get too attached and go for too long. So Clint, this was your baby. What you got?

Yeah, because I noticed this. I noticed this trend with different personalities in the spectrum, right? We tend to you know, I’s love to carry it on like it’s always you know, they love me they’re gonna buy from you eventually. And you just take it down this path of like, come on guy, you got to call it quits. You got to have a hard stop. And and I see this constantly throughout sales, sales teams, people trying to sell to me, and it’s like, Man, I’ve told you no four times, John, how many times do I text you, you know in the middle of somebody trying to sell me and I’m like, I’ve told this guy No, go f himself. And he’s still trying to sell me right. And, and so, you know, the reason that I really wanted to talk about this is because I feel like even sometimes myself, I get caught in a trap because I need a sell, right? I’m short this month, I have a quota. And I and I invested so much time already, that it’s so hard for me to dump it and start over. But the data tells me I should and that’s tough for me being task driven to start a task and not finish it. So, you know, for me, you got to set that no as an end as they win. And that’s, that’s a kind of a mindfuck for a lot of people out there.

I say you, if you start with your attitude is I’m going for the No. Right. I think you’ve already won the game on any of these conversations. Sounds like it’s over right? Should we discuss how we you know how I exit or you know, show me the door No, no, no, no, that’s not what you know. So again, give them the opportunity, push that pendulum back and forth and challenge them for why we should even have one more word said at this sales meeting, right?

Yeah, that’s a great way to approach it for sure.

So when you said I’s tend to want to drag it out. I’m like, you know, I think maybe I want to be able to come back in because I always leave the door open, but I try

Yeah, you don’t burn a bridge.

No I don’t burn the bridge. But I do say Well it sounds like this probably would never be something you would use. So should we maybe just throw this you know throw this back in my bag.

And what bothers me the most when I see it with an I is that you have out of all the personalities, you have the best tools in your toolbox to tell somebody This is over and still have the opportunity to come back. And and I think the and I’ll call it because I always say dumbass D, right the uneducated D, The unaware D, I’ll say in this case, unaware I if you don’t understand yourself. This is where you make the biggest mistake, right is you burn a bridge and you didn’t have to you can come back tomorrow. And that is something that I see I’s do every single day. And C, C’s I don’t see do it as much because they’re so fact-driven, right? Is that okay? The data is not there. This is just over, and they call it a win. And then I’m curious how how far do you because I would guess, in my mind that, that love and that compassion, you wouldn’t want it to end either. So little curious on how you do that?

So, um, the first thing I was thinking in regards to this conversation, is people don’t want to tell me no, even if they don’t, you know, they don’t want to do any business. They there. It’s really hard for people to say I you know, they’re just not mean to me. They don’t, they never want to be mean. And they always want to say as nice as they possibly can. You know, I’m just not ready. And so in the beginning of being in sales, and probably it’s hard to stop, but in the beginning, I would just be like, Oh my gosh, everyone loves me and they’re gonna buy everything. And I believed it. Because that’s what I heard because because I’m an S, I really believe they, they were, were just like, Oh gosh, I don’t wanna hurt her feelings. And I had to become really intuitive and go, Oh, that this doesn’t fit. It was kind of like a puzzle. And if it didn’t fit, I needed to figure that out quickly. But I there were incidences that I would get in trouble from my boss at the very beginning. And he was like, What do you Why do you keep going back to that office? And I said, because they’re gonna, they will write for me, they’re gonna, it’s gonna happen. I can tell. And he’s like, No, you’ve gone 20 times and I but I knew. And so that was just one of those skills. I just naturally have I knew intuitively consider what someone was going to do. And I don’t know if that’s an S thing. But I do know that you have to figure that out. Like when someone sells something to me, I very quickly, very nice, very kind, will tell them, I don’t I will not buy your device or whatever. I’m not going to do it. I don’t I don’t want it. And I really appreciate you know, and I’ll, I’ll be very kind to them. But I want to make sure I tell them what I that I’m not going to do it. Because I hate when people are nice to me when they don’t really have any intention to further business with me. Does that make any sense? I don’t know if that makes any sense to y’all. So I think that’s one reason I really like Clint, because he’s so direct. And I and I actually appreciate that. I hate the game. You know where I want to know, but for some reason people have trouble with an S to be direct. I mean, maybe not if you’re not a D, but did was that too jumbled? Was that too answering too many…

No, I think I think that makes a lot of sense. And in the, I think that everyone is kind of worried or concerned about selling to D’s because they are known for being abrupt, you know, especially once you kind of dig into this a little bit deeper. And but here’s the deal, like, I know exactly where I stand, when I’m talking to Clint or anybody else who’s a D because they don’t care enough about my feelings to lie to me, right? If I’m wasting Clint’s time, I’m going to hear about it. Right. And there’s a there’s a, there’s a comfort in that whenever you can disconnect from, you know, the emotions or the outcome enough to just be like, you know what, I’m going to leave here with some clarity about what this is actually going to look like. And that’s awesome. Whereas it is super easy to be Oh, yeah, sure. You know, let me think about it. Yeah, that sounds pretty good. And then you know, you get maybe a maybe a false stall or, you know, objection that isn’t really the real objection, because they’re just trying to be nice, and they don’t feel comfortable sharing the truth.

But wouldn’t it be better to just point that out to them? You know, hey, John, when people say that, you know, they need to think about it, it’s usually a polite way of saying no, and they just don’t want to come out and say it. Is that is that where we’re at? Because if it is, it’s okay to say no. And, you know, we part, you know, as people that, you know,

But that is a learned skill. So I totally agree. I think that is something you need if you don’t have that you need to develop that. Well.

So I think that that’s largely personality driven, you know, in the beginning, because because it’s a fairly uncomfortable question.

I didn’t do it in the beginning. I literally did not.

Oh, absolutely. I don’t think anybody comes like, like, hits the pavement on that first day. And they’re like, Is it over? You know, I don’t think anybody’s doing that.


Yeah. So I, I talked about the role plays, you know, that I’ve been doing in a recent episode and this one woman she came in, we had a great conversation. I roleplay her stuff back to her. She loved it. She was fired up. And she was like, okay, what’s next? What did we do all these things? And then I was like, cool. And so I gave her I gave her the lowdown. And she goes, she was quiet, right? Because now we’re back in DMs, right that this is off of, you know, the phone call. And so she waits a couple of days. And she’s like, yeah, I’m swamped and busy and everything else. And I’m like, cool. And then because I didn’t want to like finger wag at her because I know that’s, I know, that’s not gonna be helpful. And so I kind of waited about a day and I was like, Hey, you know, did you have any more thoughts about the call? And she said, Well, this and this and this and said, okay, you said it was really important to get past this hurdle of doing these kinds of conversations. And she said, Yeah, I said, Can I ask you a question? She said, Sure. I said, How much of the reason of not moving forward with me was due to price. She goes 95%. I was like, okay, you know, thanks for letting me know. What does it need to be at? You know, like, like, where does the value disconnect for you in relation to where you are right now. And then I got to have a really great conversation about where she actually was financially and what her budget could look like for doing something with me and things like this. But it was it was out, it was only after she gave me that no, and we talked through it in a way that was non threatening to her or non judgmental to her.

John, you bring up a really good point, because when I say, you know, I go for the No, it’s not because I don’t want to ask the hard questions, right, because I think some people just try to get out of there. Right? Yeah, instead of really figuring out why they won’t buy today from you. So, you know, a lot of times, you know, and Nan has seen this when we just have something that’s just not a good fit, right. We’ve asked all the questions, we’ve gotten some feedback, doctors kind of holding it, but he’s just not going anywhere with it. You know, he then we establish Hey, this, let’s just go ahead and let’s go for this. No, but I always follow up with Is it okay if we call on you when we think we have another product you might want to see. And they’re like absolutely call I’ve never had somebody No, never come back.

Right. And, and that’s really important because you know, the thing, the thing is, is that in Al and Nannette’s world very specifically and I think to Clint as well, there’s only so many people that you guys can partner with and work with, right and Al and Nannette very specifically carry a very large product line. So, you know, that’s really important. Okay, cool. This is a no for today. Let me get out of your hair. You know, the next thing that pops up on the radar, can I can show that to you? Oh, sure. Absolutely. What would that need to look like for it to be even worth having a discussion about? Well it needs to do this and this and this, okay, why? And then you’re having like the conversation you want to have, but to to this idea of when do you call it over? Sometimes, you know, if you’ve got a defined territory, or there’s only so many targets, you know, it makes sense to you know, give it the full, the full You know, Monty, and like, stay consistent and try to nurture it and build the relationship because, you know, Clint’s talked about the fact that they’ll spend six months in, you know, trying to build trust. Right. And so

That’s not to I think it’s really important. It was said a few minutes ago, not to burn bridges. Just because you’re getting a no does not mean that’s it, there’s an end to the relationship. I mean, if nothing else, build a relationship that you can come might be able to revisit later. I mean, that’s that I think it’s

I didn’t think about it that way whenever I was working with Al, and so I was so scared to. Okay, this isn’t for you just let me know. Like, like, like, that was like, you know, suicide by you know, self disembowelment. Right. It was so like, that wasn’t even an option. Like No, man, I can’t let this person Tell me No. So let me just let him think about it or let me pressure them or let me do any of these things. So there’s no there’s a level of awareness that happens once you can do these things and have that mindset of like, cool, it’s a no for today, that’s fine. There’s other people to go talk to you. And eventually, maybe there’s an opportunity. So let me just make sure that I’m in the game long enough for that opportunity. Whenever it does inevitably come around, then I can still be here in the game.

Well and to that statement, I think it’s really important to address that. If you are going to live or die from the yes or the no from one person. I mean, that that that that you’re setting yourself up to fail, because you cannot all that weight cannot be on someone’s decision. You know at that that’s, trot. Really, if you are in that mindset, you’ve really got to work around how there’s a million I you know, I hate to say it because I have said, oh, there’s a million people for a million people. I mean, it’s so ridiculous to think there’s just this one person, this one sale that you’re gonna,

You know, here’s the deal it not to cut you off Nan, because because you’re making a really good point, but, you know, I could easily find a metaphor for like each three of us to where I could show you like, you didn’t even know that there was another option until like someone showed it to you, or, or until you had a mindset shift for you know, think about, you know, like in Kung Fu, right? You know, this idea that this simple little structure is going to cause deflections, and it’s going to, like protect me that never even entered into the mind before like, like, it wasn’t even on the scale of something that I could do, let alone do to, to to deflect the technique. So this idea that like, Oh, it’s just a no for today, until you get to the point where you realize, Oh, yeah, that’s really a thing. It doesn’t even register something. There are people who are going to listen to this and they’re going to hear it and they’re gonna say, Oh, yeah, it’s easy for them to say that, because I’ve been in that boat.

That is the purpose of this podcast, as far as I’m concerned is showing people we’ve been down the road here. How you do it? Here’s what to expect. Here’s if you get into this mindset how to you can shift because every mindset can be shifted, you know, good or bad. But we are trying to direct people into a better mind shift because we stay we said, the last two episodes, we’ve talked about your mindset and that is vital in every area of life. And we’re talking sales, but it’s so important. You’re gonna your attitude, you know, are you preparing for further growth? And if you’re not, then you’re just stagnant and who you’re not going to succeed if you’re stagnant.

Clint, you’re being quiet over there buddy. What are your thoughts?

Yeah, no, it’s all great. So it’s funny because I always seem to find myself on the other side of the coin right and far off in the other corner of the spectrum to where I go for the no so hard that I literally run out of people to ever give me a yes. And and that’s a so it literally happened today, my senior estimator was he told me, because because he brought me a job, he’s like, do you want it? You know, what do you want to take a look at this? And I said, I looked at the customer. As soon as I saw the customer on the bid sheet, I said, No, we don’t bid to them. Because we bid seven of them to him last year, they’re dead to me, done. And we’re just not wasting our time. And he literally looked at me with a straight face and said, Clint, we got a bid to somebody to win a job. You know, and it hit me for a second. It’s like, he’s got a point. Right? And, and it takes the little bit of both worlds of everything that you’re talking about, and a little bit of what I’m talking about and slamming it together. Because I look at a guy like my buddy Brian, up in, you know, nowhere Illinois selling no loans at a bank, right? If he says 50, if he gets 50 noes, he, he’s one shy away from run out of a pool of customers. I mean, he just doesn’t there’s not this big market there. Right. And so how do you get to the no and leave yourself with options afterwards? And that’s kind of what you got. We’re talking about it’s all great advice and and and I have to you know I have to also imply you know put that into my world as well towards like I can’t just say no and and they’re dead to me because that is a natural inclination for a corner D to go to is they pissed me off one way or another I’m professionally or personally insulted so they’re just dead to me they don’t exist I’ll never looked at them again. That is so natural for me to go to that I can burn up a market in my, in my pool of customers so fast.

But Clint, I hear that and I’m like going oh, I want to be your sales manager because what you do okay, I think so humbling that so so what you got seven noes. Go in there in a different way with a different person. Send someone else.

I got it. I got it. Here’s what you do. You go pick one, then you say. Like in third grade, you just slide the note open. Yes or no. Right?

So if you’re just listening, you need to go watch the YouTube to see what Al put on his tablet and showed right there because yeah, it was a visual. He’s turning into Carrot Top. He’s like prop comedy over here. But um, yeah, I think that’s really interesting. Because I mean, because I know I know your process, Clint because we’ve talked about it so often have, you know, you’ll you’ll, and maybe this is changing. I’m curious. But like in the past, you would do a bid as like a way to get in the door and start building some trust and building the relationship so that way you get to do the next job the right way. Has that shifted from…

No, I still do that. What I what I did, to be honest with you in the last two companies I’ve worked for I’ve come in and one of the great things about hiring a D is even just a just a normal salesperson, right? Is that when you you have a list of 50 so for example, two companies ago I came in there’s 256 line items that they would run through every week and said these jobs are still active. I’m like, there’s no way you have $182 million worth of construction projects that were bid in three years ago that are still Well, yeah, no, they haven’t said no. So Oh, but but that’s what people like to see. Right? Because they like big numbers. They like to forecast these unrealistic things. And out, you know, so for example, John, you run CRM, right? You sell these things and you push people to you know, to use KPIs and CRM if people leave, ever leave everything they ever did in the pending column. What what metrics Do you have to measure how well you’re doing right? So I made it. I made it a personal goal to literally destroy 256. I remember the number because I was just astonished. And I got it down to like 20 in maybe like,

So you went to see if you went from 256 down to 20 real possibilities.

Real, real things that were pending right? Now you can measure the metrics of what you have in the pipeline, right? And when I came to this company, it was a very similar thing. And, and every time I’m, I wipe something off, you know, I’ll have, you know, my boss look at me and say, Hey, are you sure about that? I’m like, Look, I made the call. They don’t even know if the project’s happening. So why keep it? Let’s just count it as a no, get it off the radar. So we stopped forecasting the stupid thing because we, because every month we forecast and we change the date to a month later, like that is that is as good to know to me as anything, right?

It’s kind of like my to do list right? I just I move it a day up a day up.

Yeah, my my standard whenever I’m working with a team is that well, any any tool that I’m going to use, you can assign an activity to somebody without having to have like an active deal because if you can only create activities for deals that are open then that’s kind of a flawed system, but Like the standard for every client that I set up is if you don’t have a next step on the books, it’s mutually agreed upon between you and them. It’s on the calendar. There’s a reason to discuss and it’s not just like, hey, let’s check in right let’s check in to discuss where we are right you know, something a little bit more direct than that, then they don’t need to be in your pipeline whatsoever. Because what because what’s happening is you’re building yourself into a space where you we forget everything, right? We forget everything that’s not in front of us, right? Especially when when we’re so busy so if you have five deals you haven’t talked to you in three months and you’re just looking at like the overview your pipeline, you’re telling yourself stories that are not true. Yeah, right. Yeah, and that’s just you got to be so honest with yourself because it is so easy to hide your head in the sand, you know, yeah. And not and not be honest with yourself. I close everybody I sit down across with no, you don’t, but I hear it. I hear that probably three times a week from from people I talk to.

People actually tell you they close every deal they sit down with?

Yep. John I don’t need anything because let me tell you my close rate. Liar. This guy goes I closed 85% of the time and I was like, cool, man, I’d love to see like, like, how you’re tracking that? And he goes, Yeah, I’m like, cool, right? Like,

yeah, and you know, there’s there’s a mentality there too, because a lot of guys, it’ll say that only count the wins. Exactly. Yeah. And so it’s really easy to have a 95% hit ratio when all you do is enter the ones that you’ve got, right? And you forget about all the stuff. And in all reality, you’re probably at a 7% and, and the thing is, is those those realistic, because because to be honest with you, and with COVID and 2020, election year and my industry, all the all the shittiest things that could happen to you are literally here. And if you’re if you’re at a 35, 36% hit ratio in my industry, man, kudos to you tell me what you’re doing. Give me because I am not there. I’m at an all time low. It is what it is. And you know you’re battling out but how do you battle out of the all time low? If you don’t know what the hell it is you’re doing. Right? And you don’t

Or, well, or if you don’t know if you don’t know it’s the all time low right? That’s right. You haven’t been honest. Right? Exactly. to yourself. And yeah,

The guy telling you that he’s closing everything, you know that guy’s full of shit. Because I’ve never I’ve never not once ever met one person that has just killed it every meeting he goes to right and and there’s a mentality there to have probably being a little you know, in your own head and, and coming out of that meeting said do not crush that we didn’t win this because it was estimated we didn’t win that because I brought you Oh, yeah. Right. And I

Wait a second, is Donald Trump selling today?

It’s funny because I was thought I was describing you but

Shots fire, shots fired.

Love it, I love it. But yeah, you know, you know, I killed it today dammit.

Yeah, I killed it man and and what does kill it mean? You know all those exactly things? Yeah, very, very relative terms to the situation, I think, you know, kind of getting back to going down that rabbit hole. Everybody has to have some sort of check in place right during your process there has to be a stop in there somewhere a mental pause to say Do I go to the next step or can I can I just end this right now, can I get the no right now? And I can tell you in most everything I do, I have to play a certain game in the market. And I and I play it because that’s just the way it is. And Doc, I think you’re probably in there a little bit where I have to get all the way through the bidding proposal process before I can even get to know because because they don’t, they can’t tell you anything until you they have a number in front of them. That’s the game I live in. Right so you know a lot of people’s sales process i’d fail miserably at their process, because they would have told me to go for the no nine steps ago and I mine’s just not mine doesn’t allow that, right. So you have to adapt to what your market is.

Agreed. I mean, you’re in a different arena. So ours can can be, you know, we and one of the things I learned early on in my particular industry is I got a big bag of tricks, right? Only show one at a time, and maybe one other this may be connected to it. So you don’t go vomit all your your marbles, like you said ahead of time or drop all your things, you know, you tease it out. And along the way you build relationships, you find out a little more information. I mean, yeah, there’s a definitely a methodology to most sales, depending on the industry, and seeing, you know, you got to follow that pattern.

Yeah, and I also say this is that, uh, if I would follow some of the sales training that I’ve had to a tee and this is why it’s so important to adapt what you learned to yourself to your personality and also to your industry and market, and even at the end of the day to your company, right? Because there’s certain things that you can and can’t do within all of that. And if I would have followed some of the sales processes that people told me, this is a must, if you do these 10 steps, you win, right? If I do that, I wouldn’t have a customer left, because I got noes in the first five minutes. But I’ve won jobs if I kept going, right. So there’s a happy medium that you have to go through. But you have to know what your, your process is, right? It’s not the same for every one person.

So John, what are you let’s say, let’s say that I come to work for you Clint, right? And you’re coaching me, right? And you’re and you’re being super patient and putting up with all my questions, which we both know wouldn’t actually happen. But I come to you and I’m trying to figure out this line of when do I really call this thing over versus let’s keep nurturing this thing? You know, when you talk about it being by feel Right. And that to me presents a problem, right? Because feel is nuanced. It’s ambiguity. It’s mystified. Right? So how do you clarify that so that someone else can do it as well as you can.

So so one of the things I’ll tell you is don’t forget that D’s are task-driven, right? I have the same metrics. I track them different. I track them in my mind, I track them with my, that’s how I develop the gut feel. I don’t have a gut feel like like Al has where it’s just in the moment feel. I have a gut feel because I’ve had past data to get me there. It’s a different gut feel right? And we have it but they’re, they’re very different. How we got there is very different. So I track a lot of metrics, I track a lot of, Okay, I bid seven things to this guy. He’s never given me feedback. I don’t know where I stand with that guy. Those metrics are in there. They’re all inside my head. If I could ever put those out on paper, man, I’d be really ahead of the game. And I try as much as I can, just doesn’t come natural like it does for you.

But, but Clint, back on on that whole metric thing, a lot of times I’m going in knowing who this doctor works with, what kind of products they’ve used in the past. I mean, I can write it all down, but I know the guy that slinging it, I know my competition looks like I know how this is. So So I run through metrics. And to John to your point, it’s hard to


quantify those particular metrics, I can put them on a piece of paper but I just be looking at stuff I already know in my head, when I have to do is figure out what my competitive edge is, whether it be through my product, or some some miss that occurred on the, you know, with the other vendor that I heard about, or some transition the doctor’s in so timing has a lot to do with this. So there are these these these intangible items that do play into the conversation. So I kind of go in a blank slate with a lot of information sitting in my back pocket, and then we start the process. Does that make sense? So it’s hard to quantify.

Yeah. And I’ll tell you another thing is it what I love, I love watching I’s work a room, especially like in a networking event because by the end of the night, a lot of those guys will have not not the process that their company has that they sent them there with. But they’ve adapted their process to the customer because somehow some freakin way and all your chitter chatter and all your, your crazy whatever you call it Mojo that you get going, you get their process out of them, right? And now you can measure Okay, well, this guy’s not gonna buy from me this time because we have this companionship going on.

But shouldn’t we all ask that question? John, how does this work? Please help me out here. I’m a little confused or Wow, you guys do it that way. Why don’t you do it this way? I mean, how hard is that question to ask? Just don’t go in trying to tell your customer how they need to do their damn business.

So here’s, here’s

That’s the nugget.

It is the nugget. And I’ll tell you this. And I’m going to add to that a little bit because John, I sent you an email the other day about, you know, kind of we get this wrong where we think we talked about sliding to different personalities like this is where it really comes into play is I can I can slide to an I pretty easily in a social situation I can go to, you know, if I’m running numbers and facts and figures, I can slide to the C. I have a really hard time sliding to an S, but I don’t need to slide over there, right? I need to look at a situation being myself through Nan’s glasses, if you will, right. I just need to understand there needs to be some compassion there. When I’m dealing with a C I need to understand that they need some numbers and facts and figures. And I still have to be me. I can’t lose who I am because I have a lot of awesome traits as well. In the situation, course you do. Of course. Absolutely. I mean, most of my traits are awesome. But when I slide there, I need to I need to use some of the tools of the I toolbox not become an I, because that’s so unnatural, and you can’t hold on to that very long,

Man. So I wasn’t gonna bring this up. But Clint sent me an email on Friday. And it was a very great email because at the top of it, he put he put a bunch of information out there that was relevant, and he knew he knew that I would have to read the whole thing. So halfway down, he goes from sharing this idea about the shades which which I thought was really cool and relevant to Hey, can I tell you something and literally word for word, I don’t give a fuck if you care or not, however, and then went on to like write some some very nice feedback and and it was nice. And he goes, I wrote all the shit at the top just to make sure that you would actually read this because I know you can’t quit something halfway through and it was like, I was so astounded by like, how how greatly and how smoothly that was done and how much he pulled back the curtain. Like that was a that hit me harder than the compliment that at the end of the email, because I was I was so blown away because I, you know, because of what I do, I think I think it probably spent a little bit more time getting exposure to this stuff, you know, then then I think the rest of you do. But that was so smooth and well done. And just like directly on point because I can imagine the toil that Clint was going through trying to write out this like email, there was probably like, like, like five paragraphs. I mean, I mean, it was significant, right? And like the kind of emails that I love to write that nobody ever wants to read. So like to get one from my buddy. I’m like, I’m like, Oh, yeah. And then there’s a compliment at the end of it that I almost didn’t miss because I’m just so dumbfounded that this was so purposeful and intentional and intentional. It was awesome man, thank you.

But you know who does that well, is Nanette as well. When we go into these offices. She starts laying this groundwork that draws them in, right. I mean, it’s beautiful and she just does it naturally with her being nice. And asking the right questions. And I’m like, get to the point right there, like, are we ever gonna talk business? Because but then the next thing you know, they’re coming at her and she’s asking questions because they, they they’ve kind of fallen into that little trap. So yeah, I mean, you know, don’t be afraid to use that guys. I mean, I’m speaking to the audience. If you know that you can suck somebody in or captivate their interests suck somebody in maybe sounds derogatory, but if you can captivate somebody’s interest in what’s going on, then you you you know, you’re you’re winning. You’re winning because they’re coming at you with a conversation at that point.

You’re so good at.

It is not sucking someone in. It’s people will not listen if you do not if they don’t care, if you don’t show that they that you care about them. Uh, you know, I mean, it’s just like raising kids. I always think that, you know, if kids don’t listen, if they don’t feel love, you know that when they feel loved then they’re like, Alright, I really, you know, it’s the same thing with sales, you you have to build a relationship, even if it’s very shallow in the beginning, but you do have to build a relationship with that person, get to know them a little bit. Don’t just go in throwing up on them. You know, the other day this guy, this is so silly, maybe to share but this guy I was out front watering. I have, they’re called Happy lights, they’re not Christmas lights on one of my big trees. And I just keep it up because every time I’m out there, people stop and go, Oh, man, I love those lights. That just I love getting home at night and those lights are on, you know. Well, the other night I’m out there watering this guy. You’re making everyone dizzy Albert. Sorry, I’m about out of battery. Okay, so I’m out there. And this guy comes up, it’s like 8:30 at night, he go and he starts talking to this young guy and he just starts talking to me about he goes, What’s the deal with the lights? And, and I was like, gonna talk to him because everyone’s always talking to me about the lights. And so we started talking and he engaged he was perfectly polite. And he says, and by the way, do you need an exterminator? And I was like, and I but I thought I should have told him and I didn’t, but I think he’s gonna do well because he engaged. He didn’t just walk up and say, do you have roaches or you know, whatever I don’t know what he could have said that. You know, if I didn’t get a sale so you know that happens sometimes. I don’t, you know what I’m saying? I just think it’s really important to engage. Okay.

No, I I agree with you. I the one thing that I was gonna compliment you on is Nan has got her tonality so locked in that she could walk up and ask you an offensive question, but it doesn’t even register as offensive because of her tonality and her presence, whereas I feel like if I ask a question that’s maybe not even a quarter as abrasive, right, I have to work really hard on my tonality because it just comes across like, really, you know, like to people like like my, um, you know, like, like, I can’t even I can’t even like, you know, active listen in a way that’s nurturing, right? It’s always just like, like, like that. So I had to work very hard at that. And then that has that easily and you said something in there. I’ve been working with a new coach and he’s got this line that he talks about all the time. He goes, No one knows no one cares how much you know, until they know how much you care. Right. And I think I’ve heard you say something along those lines on this show, but like, it’s been something that I’ve been thinking about like a lot, because, you know, I kind of run around trying to be the guy with the most knowledge so that you have to trust me, you know, when I should be approaching it the other way. So, Al, you okay over there buddy?

Oh, I had a fan in this room that I plugged in so I was afraid to feed in too much noise through so cut it off now.

Do you have any, Do you have any errands to run or anything real quick?

Well my bladders full, could I go and do that?

No, we’re gonna wrap up. Clint, closing thoughts before we get out of here.

Yeah so going down the rabbit hole right just, you know stay aware of your situation know that your process has to have some allowed stops in place for you to check the situation and know that you know, hey, this is my market I live in this every day I see what wins I see what fails. You develop that? That culture and along the way you’ve got to have enough you know, deep down gut driven you know know how to say this is this is it right here I’m going for it and and get the no or get the get the go ahead to move on but at some point, you know calling it quits and starting over a you know the famous saying you can’t lose it if you’ve never had it. And I will say don’t forget that.

Al, any closing thoughts?

No, I hit on what Clint just said, know what works in your industry know how to get out of your own way and and be digging in for the process of your client, right? How do they make decisions, you know what motivates them to move in your direction. And so look for that motivation and play to it in your own way with your own personality. And like Clint said earlier, and it goes back to if you’re going to slide over to be a D, make sure that that’s the right move to make, and then work on your timing and your approach. And then if you got to slide to a C, work on your timing and your approach, but still take an I, in my case, I’d still want to be an I that says, hey, here’s the data. I didn’t come up with it. Somebody else did, right? But I can read numbers off of a sheet. What do you think about these, you know, and particularly if the guy’s a D, or a C what what do I have to lose to say, hey, John, could you take a look at these numbers? What do you think about those? Right? So you put it in their court, don’t try to tell people who they are, what they are, how they should buy.

Man, that’s awesome. Nan, do you have anything to add?

I do, um, I’m gonna make a statement. And I would like to ask for how to not make a comment today. If we can talk about it later, potentially, but I would ask…

Jesus Christ lord and savior,

It’s opening up a big but I think this is very relevant to what we’re talking about. I think that understanding is everything. Know what you’re doing, you know, prepare, get understanding. There’s I would like to read a quote, or I don’t it’s not a quote. It’s I would like to read one sentence. When the country is in chaos. Everybody has a plan to To fix it, but it takes a leader of real understanding to straighten things out. That’s in Proverbs 28. Two. I don’t know who that, I know who the leader is.

I thought it was I thought was Donald Trump’s campaign slogan.


I’m thinking Joe Biden, Joe Biden. All right.

All right, so for the C’s out there before, this totally dissolves into a political conversation. The thing to remember is, is you don’t have to show them everything, right. Figure out what they want to take a look at, you know, talk about what’s important to them. Because until you do that, they’re not going to trust that you’re looking out for what is actually important to them like outside of their view, right? You can’t illuminate a potential problem whenever their walls are up because they don’t trust you. So you don’t have to show them everything. And you don’t always have to lead with like the top offer. Figure out what is really important to them while you’re qualifying them is that when you make offers around what’s important, as long as you can come back, right offer additional help and additional value as as Al was talking about earlier, right? Don’t go for like the no for forever, but go for the new of like, hey, sounds like this isn’t the right thing for you. Is that is that where we are? Get that closure, so that way you can, because when you don’t, and they’re telling you something that they think you want to hear, it’s harder to go back in there because they’re uncomfortable sometimes because they think that like, okay, I told them no. So so now they’re gone. So make it really okay for them to tell you.

No, no, I, I’m gonna correct you for just one second. They didn’t tell you no. they just put you off with the promise of tomorrow when it should have been a no, then you would have been better buds at least about something. And you know, not the particular item you’re trying to sell. But the opportunity is still there because when you pick up the phone and call and you haven’t closed it out, the guy thinks you’re calling about what you should have closed out. So he’s going to avoid you. Don’t do that to yourself.

I think that’s I think that’s the nugget. I like, I wasn’t intending to say that. And then it just kind of came out. And I was like, Oh, I think that’s really important. Because if they if they think that they still have to hide, they don’t want to talk to you again, right? So you’re doing yourself and themself a favor, especially in these situations where you’ve got multiple products or like a defined territory, or only so many potential targets to go work with. Go make it really easy. Hey, hey, you know, like, if I was still in Al’s world, Hey, Doc, you know, we’ve got this new set, I’d like to show it to you, you know, if it’s not a fit, I would love for you to just tell me No. Right? And then just be be okay with that. So that way when they tell, you know, when you show up the next time, they know it’s not about that. They know they don’t have to continue the Oh yeah, still thinking about you know, that kind of stuff.

So, can I add one thing before we go in and I only want to bring this up because it keeps getting I keep hearing all these different sales tools, right. And if you buy these 10 steps, you will be successful, and you spend maybe years in a sales training or with a coach and stuff. What I want to say here is that we touched on a minute ago it’s all it’s all has to be tuned towards you. These are templates these are guides absolutely and and i and i love i love that these things are out there and I love that you can buy a 10 step program or a sales process I love that you can buy this stuff but guys you have to gear this to you and and even personality training, right, there’s no one personality train has it all. Because remember this every process that is up today, that is the new wave took the place of the one that said the exact same thing 10 years ago, right? It’s just it’s progressive.

There’s this idea, good point, in stand up comedy that like like your first two to three years of being a stand up. I mean, even if you’re performing regular you’re just doing your version of your favorite comedian. Yeah, right. Like, like, like you It takes time to develop your own cadence and your own tonality and your own bits and stuff like this. And I’ll be the first to admit, I mean, the first probably two years of me being like on this path of being coachable, and working with coaches and everything else like this, I was just trying to sound like Geof, and you know, my coach Scott, I mean, let, that’s all I was trying to do. And it wasn’t until I was like, Oh, I need to do this stuff is John and not John trying to be Geof or Scott, you know, all the time, that’s where it really changed. So, you gotta, you gotta, you got to put in the reps to own this. And that’s why I do the roleplay groups that I do. So that way you get enough reps that you don’t have any choice but to eventually start speaking your language as your authentic self and covering the important things in your process. So huge point. Good point. Good point. Yeah,

Good point, good point. Yeah, I completely agree with both was what clearly within what you’re talking about now? Absolutely. Yeah, gotta be yourself.

Yeah, totally worth coming back in for that. So thanks, man. All right, everybody. Same as usual. If you are struggling in sales, if you’re not hitting your goals, if you’re not sure why, if you’re tired of the pressure of not knowing how to get to where you need to go Reach out, let’s let’s talk about it, right, because it might be a personality thing, it might just be a lack of clarity, it could be any number of reasons, but we can help with with all of it. So if you’re struggling to,

and to the point of what we just said, if you have a process that you’re bought into, your company’s bought into, we can help you tailor what you’re dealing with to the process. We have plenty of talent within this group to do that.

Absolutely. I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s 8:19 on on a Wednesday afternoon, we’ve all put in a full day. So don’t, we are here, we’re committed to what we’re trying to do here, which is shorten that learning curve, you know, put some processes in the gaps or, you know, help you guys with some of these hard points that, you know, sales isn’t easy, okay? But it’s doable, and it can be a great profession, and it can be so rewarding on so many different levels. So you know, if you’re having problems, this is how you get it done, guys. It’s how you get past those problems.

Knowledge and awareness, then practice, right. You train, train, train, train. So…

Education and opportunity, man, that’s how you beat poverty within yourself and in any given community, education and opportunity. Nice, awesome.

Nice, awesome. So if you know someone who is struggling, if they’re in a sales role, and they don’t know about this, share it with them, right? We don’t need to make it harder. Yeah, it’s hard. It’s hard enough, especially right now with all the COVID stuff and things being in flux. So don’t make it harder than it needs to be get some help. Right? There’s there’s mental toughness and grit. And we’ve been talking about that. But there’s also knowing that there’s room to improve and sometimes you’re not able to find that on your own. So if you want to take this assessment, DISC@salesthrowdown.com, we will get you hooked up. If you have questions, or if you want to share your struggles or where you’re hung up. please tweet us at Sales Throwdown on Twitter, on Facebook is also on Sales Throwdown comment on the YouTube videos, let us know, leave a review. We read every one of them and this is really why we’re here. So we will see everybody next week. Thank you so much and have a good night. Good night.